Lysander
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I'm sick of people claming Bush killed these soldiers. Bullets did. Or land mines. Or bombs being dropped on their heads. They knew what they were getting into when they signed on the dotted line.
And this image is in extremely poor taste, even for me.
10/5/2004 1:46:53 AM
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Cute N Confuzd
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i just did the math and on there it is 1363 photos, now as unfortunate as that is, that is pretty damn good for a war that has been going on over a year. What all you people that post shit like this are doing is taking away the honor that those people have died for and making it into an evil that is inevitable. I am prior military and have many friends that have also VOLUNTEERED to go to Iraq. It's pride and honor that our troops carry over there, not hatred. Bush is doing what is best for our country with war. Would you rather us stand down again like WW2 and let young women and children die b/c they are being forced to walk onto military bases with grenades strapped to their chests? These people died for our country with pride and now you people are stripping them of that by blaming Bush for their deaths, like he MADE them go. Hate to break it to ya, but our military is on a volunteer basis and there is a waiting line to go to Iraq. Bush didn't just take random men and women, hand them a gun, and say go. They went and founght for this country with pride and lost their lives as American soldiers. Don't take that away from them b/c you hate Bush, just vote against him. Bush has given our military better conditions and pay, it's not his fault they were killed. We have a responsibility as a world power to keep countries like Iraq in check and our soldiers are proud to go over there and help some of these people that cant help themselves. God bless these men in women.
10/5/2004 2:00:55 AM
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Becky
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amen
10/5/2004 3:15:53 AM
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tampacheercoach
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I dont think anyone said Bush forced anyone to join the army, but if no war had been started no one would have died. So in an offhand sort of way he is responsible.
10/5/2004 3:36:33 AM
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Justferfun
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In that sense, I would think it more Saddamn's fault, as he did not agree to the ultimatium which led to war.
Was President Roosevelt responsible for all those hundreds of thousands of US soldiers that died in WW2?
10/5/2004 3:52:31 AM
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tampacheercoach
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But it was Bush that gave the ultimatum, so again he would be responsible. I believe Bush knew quite well Saddam would not respond to such an ulitmatum, and if so then he also knew that war would result.
I also dont think I would compare this war with WW2 it seems to me that they are very very different.
[Edited by tampacheercoach on 10/4/2004 11:00:28 PM. Reason for edit: <0]
10/5/2004 3:59:09 AM
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Hecht Money
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Wow...That's a sad pic to look at...VOTE KERRY!
10/5/2004 4:02:43 AM
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Justferfun
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None the less, you can not blame the President for the death of a soldier in a time of war. ESPECIALLY when it is a volunteer service. That's like blaming your boss for breaking your arm because he made you work overtime.
10/5/2004 4:07:40 AM
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usfkid03
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KERRY! He may not be the best but he is 57623572472x better than Dubya.
10/5/2004 7:23:08 AM
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FBsk8er0
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1) I think alot of ppl misconstruded my message here.
2) Im not blaming him for their deaths, so that point is done.
3) The blue is coming from the backgrounds..this is damn well a collage of real pictures.
4) Not everyone over there volunteered, BELIEVE ME. If you were already active duty...you were sent over there. But none the less they probably wanted to go.
5) WW2..this..NOT the same
6) Guess what...in WW2 the children were forced to wear the grenade belts by there mothers...and most of the women did it of there own free will. Then doing that had nothing to do with our surrender, they did that because they thought it was a good idea O_o.
7) I dont hate Bush...I just dont think circus monkeys should be president
8) Frankly I think Kerry's an ass also...but ya gotta pick one
9) The black people are segregated because they make up the black background O_o
Fuck it thats enough
10/5/2004 2:49:52 PM
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burnsinat0r
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They purposely tried to misconstrue it. Otherwise they wouldn't really have a point.
10/5/2004 3:04:51 PM
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brandon1934
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quote :
4) Not everyone over there volunteered, BELIEVE ME. If you were already active duty...you were sent over there. But none the less they probably wanted to go. |
Please explain this one.
10/5/2004 3:13:21 PM
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burnsinat0r
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Not everyone wanted to go to Iraq. Some people were in the reserves as a way of making money for their education or for their families. They were in the reserves because they didn't want to go to active combat. And they didn't have to worry about combat untill Bush got into office with a plan on his mind.
10/5/2004 3:21:14 PM
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BMack
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"To invade Iraq after 9/11 is like if FDR was to invade Mexico after Pearl Harbor" -John Kerry
10/5/2004 3:33:17 PM
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tampacheercoach
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Hey LikeILuvYou, I dont think that was John Kerry's personal quote. Correct me if im wrong but I believe he was quoting someone else. In the debate before he said that, he mentioned that it was said to him by someone in the military. I will look it up but im pretty certain that he quoted that from someone else. Just thought I would try and clarify.
Heres his words from the debate:
The terrorism czar, who has worked for every president since Ronald Reagan, said, "Invading Iraq in response to 9/11 would be like Franklin Roosevelt invading Mexico in response to Pearl Harbor." That's what we have here
[Edited by tampacheercoach on 10/5/2004 11:30:15 AM. Reason for edit: found it]
10/5/2004 4:10:54 PM
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BMack
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the point is kerry said it... iwas talking online while watching the debate and yeah... i missed some stuff
10/5/2004 4:36:29 PM
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Justferfun
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quote :
Not everyone wanted to go to Iraq. Some people were in the reserves as a way of making money for their education or for their families. They were in the reserves because they didn't want to go to active combat. And they didn't have to worry about combat untill Bush got into office with a plan on his mind. |
Last I checked the reserves are a volunteer service as well. And everyone who joined signed them pretty contracts...
While they may be real pictrures, the contrast in everyone is different as to make the image of Bush in the background stand out more. This should be a proposed Iraq Memorial eh? 
And I don't think people even know why Iraq was invaded, since they keep bringing up 9/11.
10/5/2004 4:38:50 PM
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BMack
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Iraq was invaded because of possible weapons of mass destruction
Which like Kerry I can agree that Saddam was a threat and that the world is a better place without him, but there were better ways of doing about this.. it's called diplomacy
10/5/2004 4:42:07 PM
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Justferfun
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Over 10 years of failed diplomacy...
10/5/2004 4:43:58 PM
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raginghefer24
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i didn't know there was a time limit on diplomacy...
and when was the US given authority to tell Iraq and the Arab world what is best for them?
10/5/2004 4:57:32 PM
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sundoll-arwhore
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Hey Hef-- Manifest Density, remember?? .gif)
10/5/2004 5:36:38 PM
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rinpants
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bahahah i think its manifest DESTINY
10/5/2004 6:13:33 PM
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raginghefer24
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^^this is what she was referring to:
10/5/2004 6:17:49 PM
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sundoll-arwhore
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It's called a play on words  Lay off the green baby!!
[Edited by sundoll-arwhore on 10/5/2004 1:26:33 PM. Reason for edit: .]
10/5/2004 6:25:00 PM
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FBsk8er0
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quote :
Please explain this one. |
What do you mean please explain, everyone else seems to understand it just fine. If you were active duty and able to fight you were sent to Iraq whether you wanted to go or not...there were people in the military just because they wanted to be there before this war came up. Now we have all these "I wanna kill some A-Rabs" type of people in the military. Understand now?
quote :
Last I checked the reserves are a volunteer service as well. |
Last time I checked not all of them were warmongers, I doubt all of the men and women in the reserves wanted to go to Iraq.
10/5/2004 6:39:20 PM
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burnsinat0r
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Like I said previously, they signed up for the reserves as a way of making money and getting an education. And then the reserves were forced to spend two or more tours in Iraq. I'd venture to say that a good deal of them do not want to be there. And almost none of them want to die for their country in a war that isn't benefitting our country. I hate when people say that.
10/5/2004 7:51:40 PM
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Justferfun
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It's naive to think you can suck on the government's teet and not have to work for it. Reservists think they are highly intelligent; play paintball once a week and get a half decent paycheck. Unfortunately, they didn't read the contract throughly. The President can send them to Iraq, it's in their job description. Anyone who joins these volunteer services and does not approve of war, is an idiot. Apparently none of them saw "In The Army Now", hehe.
10/5/2004 8:36:05 PM
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brandon1934
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quote :
What do you mean please explain, everyone else seems to understand it just fine. |
Maybe the only people who 'understand it just fine' are those who don't know what the meaning of volunteer is.
vol·un·teer
1 : a person who voluntarily undertakes or expresses a willingness to undertake a service: as a : one who enters into military service voluntarily b (1) : one who renders a service or takes part in a transaction while having no legal concern or interest (2) : one who receives a conveyance or transfer of property without giving valuable consideration
-Merriam-Webster's Dictionary
vol·un·tary
1 : proceeding from the will or from one's own choice or consent
2 : unconstrained by interference : SELF-DETERMINING
3 : done by design or intention : INTENTIONAL <voluntary manslaughter>
4 : of, relating to, subject to, or regulated by the will <voluntary behavior>
5 : having power of free choice
6 : provided or supported by voluntary action <a voluntary organization>
7 : acting or done of one's own free will without valuable consideration or legal obligation
-Merriam-Webster's Dictionary
Reserves, active, national guard.... its doesn't matter why they signed up for the military. They all VOLUNTEERED for it one way or another knowing that they may be called upon to be put in harm's way.
Was there a draft that I didn't know about?
[Edited by brandon1934 on 10/5/2004 4:34:54 PM. Reason for edit: halb]
10/5/2004 9:28:34 PM
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FBsk8er0
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THE WAR ISNT VOLUNTARY!!! WHERE ARE YOU PEOPLE GETTING THIS IDEA FROM!!!
10/5/2004 9:43:42 PM
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Justferfun
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So you're saying that people join the military volutunarily, and it never enters their mind that there could be a war. Dear god, we may lose our best and brightest...
10/5/2004 9:46:30 PM
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FBsk8er0
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They sure as hell didnt expect one at this scale my friend
10/5/2004 9:51:51 PM
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Justferfun
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What scale is this? What's an appropiate war to expect? This is a rather minor war as far as history goes.
10/5/2004 9:54:02 PM
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brandon1934
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So let me get this straight. I'm going to join the military reserves, have them pay my way through college, and when there is a war, (approved by Congress of course) that is just an absolute outrage! I cannot believe they are going to send me to war?! How dare they!!! Oh wait... no one made me sign up for the military reserves... did they? WTF?
ps - What do you think a soldier is for? To send to college, and to be put on the government payroll to look pretty in parades and in uniform?
[Edited by brandon1934 on 10/5/2004 5:01:03 PM. Reason for edit: ps]
10/5/2004 9:54:22 PM
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FBsk8er0
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Really and trully I dont give a damn whether they thought they were going tp war or not...none the less, this war wasnt voluntary...thats all Im trying to say right now. You got sent whether you wanted to go or not.
10/5/2004 10:07:07 PM
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brandon1934
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If I buy a lottery ticket, did I voluntarily play the lottery regardless as to whether I won or lost? Or is that decided after I find out if I won or lost?
If a football player signs a contract that says if his team goes to the super bowl, he is required to play in it... when the super bowl comes and his team is going... does his team ask him if it alright with him if they play him in the superbowl? Why not? Could it be because he already agreed to it in his contract?
[Edited by brandon1934 on 10/5/2004 5:18:51 PM. Reason for edit: clarify]
10/5/2004 10:16:37 PM
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FBsk8er0
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WTH are you talking about, that doesnt even compare. That was the dumbest analogy you could've come up with. Soldiers cant say "Sarg I dont wanna go to Iraq..." they have to go. Go make a thread if you wanna discuss this any further
10/5/2004 11:23:03 PM
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TheFirstFemale
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I realize that many republicans (not all)....but many....are pro-war. What happened to making peace? I know that sounds like something an uneducated hippie would say, however, people often seem to forget unity and trying to HELP other parts of the world (not by blowing the countries and their people up). I guess we're too far into this mess for any president to get us out and save what's left of OUR troops and THEIR people.
Note: I know this sounds naieve, but let my comment be without any of the technicalities that are often "what caused this war".
10/5/2004 11:59:38 PM
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rinpants
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hahah my bad ive never seen that picture - its funny though
10/6/2004 12:09:58 AM
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TheFirstFemale
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Also- Some of the faces are duplicates.....but I still hate Bush.
10/6/2004 12:24:26 AM
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Justferfun
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Wendell, they knew that there was a risk of war when they joined THE MILITARY!!!!!!!!!!!! These are not gardeners and car mechanics we are sending to Iraq. They are SOLDIERS!!!!!!!. Their JOB is war. Holy shit are you ignorant....
And Krystle, once a stable government that can support it's people is in place, we can start bringing troops home. There will be a troops presense in Iraq for many years to come. Hell, we still have troops in Japan, Germany, South Korea, etc.
10/6/2004 2:29:35 AM
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FBsk8er0
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What did you not understand about "Go make a thread..." and another thing...I dont even know which one of my statements that was addressed to. Did I ever say that it was wrong that they got sent...no...I said this war wasnt voluntary, some of you think different.
Fuck it, Im just gonna say it...plain and simple, we are sticking our nose in someone elses business once again. There is no need for us to still be there, no one asked us to fix their government. Once we found out that nothing was there, and after we "caught" Saddam...we should've left.
Also to your point...you are still neglecting that not all of them joined the military to fight in some war. Their job ISNT war, its to protect this country...them going to war isnt protecting OUR country. That was just an act of revenge...DONT deny that. Ignorant huh, you might wanna look that up.
[Edited by FBsk8er0 on 10/6/2004 5:09:19 PM. Reason for edit: ...]
10/6/2004 2:43:02 PM
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Krystal
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I love bush, and i think thats a very nice picture. But yeah, even if the pictures are of people who have died, they are duplicated pictures.. i see the same stupid guy with a mustache like 90 times.
[Edited by Krystal on 10/6/2004 10:08:06 AM. Reason for edit: ok]
10/6/2004 3:07:19 PM
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Justferfun
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Leaving Iraq in chaos? Who's ignorant? Yea, that will look good in the world's view. Iraq would be a worse place if the US left. The government would crumble to the local warlords who are still fighting the US along side the terrorists (by terrorists I mean Al-quaida members who traveled to Iraq to fight the Americans, not insurgents/rebels). Those who hate would get a huge boost of confidence, those who love us would hate us. If you think fighting this war will increase terrorist attacks, just imagine who many more terrorists we would create if we were to tuck tail and run. John Kerry was smart enough to know that....
[Edited by Justferfun on 10/6/2004 10:34:33 AM. Reason for edit: []
10/6/2004 3:33:58 PM
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brandon1934
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quote :
Ingnorant huh, you might wanna look that up. |
HAHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAAH!!!!
10/6/2004 4:36:16 PM
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Crambone
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I like to start fires!
5/23/2005 3:10:03 AM
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GoBullz
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If we had not stepped in and disrupted the nest that was home to terrorists and terrorist training camps, then we would essentially be a sitting duck just waiting and fearing the inevitable attacks to come (See the ending of The Sum of All Fears for an idea of what the ultimate fear is). We have obviously gone on the offensive against terrorism, disrupted their capabilities, and are picking off their leaders one by one.
The United States used to believe in isolationism, an idea of minding our own business in the world, look where that got us: two world wars. As the most powerful nation, we take on the responsibility of being everyones' big brother. Remember the line from Spider-Man, 'with great power comes great responsibility'? Some people may not like it, and it is most likely because they do not understand our position, we are here to help the world.
Those are just my views, and they make logical sense, much better than anything that ive heard to date.
But I do have a question to ask everyone: Where are all of the Muslims publicly denouncing what the insurgents are doing in Iraq? I am sure that the media may be to blame by only focusing on negative things, I have only had the chance to talk to a couple of Muslims, and they seemed indifferent, or even sympathetic towards the insurgents. I'm sure its not, but I was just wondering if this is consistent or not.
Now that I have posted enough to last me for the next 5 years...
5/23/2005 3:51:55 AM
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Kf4zra
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quote :
THE WAR ISNT VOLUNTARY!!! WHERE ARE YOU PEOPLE GETTING THIS IDEA FROM!!! |
will you kindly list just one war that is voluntary for a soldier to choose whether or not he goes?
5/23/2005 4:40:13 AM
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CrazyPills69
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Yeah, but after Clinton sent me to Bosnia, I quickly found out why I was there.
Ever been to Kuwait during sand storm season?
5/23/2005 4:56:24 AM
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CrazyPills69
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And this guy isn't? Both were cowards. They both didn't "fuck up" staying out of Vietnam.
5/23/2005 5:06:13 AM
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nozflubber
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you people lack perspective in your tiny, temporal minds. i think this picture is great because it highlights those who have and will make the Bush legacy as great as it is. Choice, as well as context, in the matter is completely irrelevant.
Any one of you faggots care to tell me of the names and faces of all the men who helped Khan overun Beijing? oh, wait, you mean you don't give a shit? Neither do I, and I don't give a shit about the decaying people that helped make up this picture, but i still appreciate something like this because it demonstrates the reality perfectly. if you disagree then I say you cannot stomach the nature of our history or warfare.
[Edited by nozflubber on 5/23/2005 1:29:58 AM. Reason for edit: mango mango mango!]
5/23/2005 6:28:40 AM
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KingPin
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I'm dieing to comment regarding some of the points made in various posts above, but I'm too tired at the moment to write a long political post or enter into a debate.
...some other time perhaps. lol .gif)
5/23/2005 6:34:22 AM
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yummy247
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I don't understand why people equate the sentiment that our troops shouldn't have to die for this war with being unpatriotic or dishonoring their memory. Yes, they died serving our country. Who is disrespecting them more, the people who say they should die and continue to serve and die without question, or the people who say they shouldn't? You can die in a dishonorable war and still be honorable. No one is blaming the troops, the fingers are pointed at the government's decision to carelessly sacrifice their lives for the profit of the wealthy or control of the oil supply. People seem to forget that true patriotism often means holding your government accountable instead of behaving like sheep to the slaughter.
5/23/2005 9:22:27 AM
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